GolfHos

No reason.
(http://common-sense.blogspot.com/homer-brain.jpg)

whats wrong spanky, are you feeling a little bit bored!!! ;D ;D ;D

Well, 'FF' back at ya!

Yeah, well online email sucks!


 ;)

FF? As in 0xFF? Wouldn't that be 11111111b?

depends what base you are in
 :o

All your base are belong to us.

I was one uppin ya!

Don't get me started  ;)

My Accord hit 11111 miles on Tuesday.  I watched it roll-over.  First time I've ever had a car with that many miles and actually saw it happen.  The simple pleasures are often the best. 

What were we talking about?

Threadjacks. :D

E-mail clients have some pluses.  In fact, I quite enjoyed using mine this afternoon as I sent out a mass e-mail.

cus, web-based email cannot do that??? [sm_banghead]

doesn't it depend on which web based app it is ?

As it would for the mail program being used.

 ;)

Who cares about e-mail, just text me.

No.  Cuz I Outlook's automatic recognition of contact names, cuz I like to use some of the paragraph format options, and cuz it can request receipts.

;D

lol

Sometimes, though, that's not even close to being an option.

Hmmm, I have auto name recognition too.  Paragraph formatting is completely dependent upon how your recipient reads the email (the system and client they use) - the same is true of receipts (which I personally find useless anyway).  I can put all sorts of smilies, embedded images, and such in my emails, but if the person on the other end isn't using the same formatting it doesn't come across.

Now, if you want to use a mail-merge function and personalize a mass email for each recipient - THEN Outlook has an advantage.  And as I mentioned before - you can script behavior on incoming emails with a true client as well.  I'm not talking filters, you can do that with anything - I'm talking taking action based upon the format of an incoming email (for instance we were accepting faxes with one system, then emailing them using procmail to a storage system.  The email would contain the source and destination phone numbers and the script would deposit the fax into the proper place based upon the numbers).  Oh, and the slow, intermittent connection situation you may have.  Thats it - really. Seeking out additional reasons for why you're using it is an emotional exercise, not a logical one.

95% of the population is better off with web-based email.





Can you tell that poor email systems and usage has been a peeve of mine for quite some time?  ;D

All 3 of my accounts have web-based e-mail:  my primary account (through my ISP), my secondary account, and a junk account.  My primary account is sorely lacking online features, no address book, etc, though they did recently upgrade their "editor" to include some html.  It needs a client to be of much use.  Secondary account web-based, no auto-recognition, address book is getting better though.  Third account, junk, so it doesn't matter what it has. 

I don't use smilies or images.  It's other minor changes that tests show remain basically the same.

Receipts are not useless when the e-mail does not *require* a response.  And I've found over the past 3 years, that if it doesn't require a response, ~99% of the time I won't get one.  However, it's nice to know if it's been "read".  For that matter, even when a response is requested, I still don't always get one.  It's called communication, and it's sorely lacking. :(

An emotional exercise?  Nah, it's preferential.  I've considered moving towards web-based e-mail, and if we ever upgrade from dial-up I might just do that.



And no, I can't. ;)

Same thing  ;)



If you do look again - try Yahoo, Gmail, MSN/Hotmail, even *shudder* AOL.  Local and regional providers give you bare bones email - I've never used it.

As for receipts - they will respond or they won't - can't force em.  Receipts play no role there - which is why I find them useless.  Several people use them to 'test' people they are sending email to.  Many therefore consider it rude and offensive.  The practice of using receipts is even frowned upon here at work (where I have to use Outlook) and the email team has discussed turning the option off completely.  If only they would take the advice of Jack Welch and remove the 'reply-all' buttons too  ;)

I won't respond to receipt requested.  Refuse to even consider it.  I respond to all business emails same day even if only to let them know I'm swamped and will get to it later.  Personal email is a different animal.  Those I might ignore or deem not needing a response. 

I deal with a development company in Bangalore on a weekly basis.  They send absolutely everything with RR.  Drives me nuts.

You're wrong about webmail though.  It blows for 40+ hours-per-week use.   ;)

not if the other option is pine  [sm_disgust]

Dude...  ???

Leonardo da Vinci surrenders.

I used to find email receipts offensive, but now I just assume it's a newbie with bad netiquette.

I had an amusing phone conversation a few years ago when someone asked why I hadn't read or responded to their email, and I told them they'd receive a response after the punitive "one-week delay for requesting receipt" is up.

A slave to the auto-notify are we?  ;)

I've used both for extended periods, and cannot imagine why you think webmail blows  [sm_dontknow]

* Response times of a browser v. POP client
* Drag-and-drop capability for attachments
* Off-line accessibility
* Security (granted, only if you know what you're doing)
* Search capability
* Multiple accounts combined as desired with client app

Webmail has its place.  I use it when I travel.  I actually have 3-4 webmail accounts (Google Apps for the most part) but I enable POP and use Thunderbird.  The only concession I give to webmail is the fact that I don't have to worry about keeping SPAM filters current.  With a decent mail admin this is handled anyway but we all know decent mail admins are hard to come by.  Good ones are usually too smart to leave them as mail admins.

I thought you were a Thunderbird user. [sm_scratch]
(or was that post meant as a "cuz Im in yur mailspool" LOLcat-style joke?)

sorry, i much prefer drag and drop attachments (if you have seen my work file names you would understand!!!) and local file saving  90% of the time


maybe if we had a working samba service so I could easily get stuff between systems ... it would change my p-o-v.



pine rules of course for simply writing a new message or reply.
 ;)

That's debatable. :D  And I like to debate. :D :D

Gmail is my junk account (horrifyingly slow loading). :D  Hotmail is my secondary ('cause messenger alerts me every time I get an e-mail; great for forum replies 8)).  I don't care for yahoo, and aol makes me cringe.

I've never thought of receipts from that angle, because I personally don't mind sending them.  In fact, I'd have them on auto if it wasn't for the fact that I put myself in the "to:" and use bcc for everyone else when sending mass e-mails*, but I don't want receipts from myself. :D  I don't *think* my friends care, though.  Those that send them are the ones who know how to put it on auto, and I *think* they do.  But the last 2 points are speculation. 

Yeah, that reply all button has got to go.  How many times has their actually been a need to use it compared to how many times it's "accidentally" been used?



*that's a pet peeve of mine.  I don't need everyone's friends and friends' extended family getting my address.  Then, to top it off, that friend's extended family member gets the idea to forward it to all their friends and their friends' extended family members!  Vicious cycle.

I recommend Thunderbird.  It's basic; it's great for what most people want.  And it's great for people who don't want OE.  We set it up for my Mom and Dad.  It's perfect for them.

However, I use Outlook.  Once I switched from OE to Outlook, there was no going back.  If Mozilla ever makes an alternative for Outlook, I'd probably jump.  (More than probably....)

I use it "purposely" a dozen times a day.  It's a flat-out major time saver in my working environment.  Given 90% of my communication is collaborative in nature I can't imagine being without it.  Most of the time I don't even have the other addressees in an available address book.  I'd be cutting-and-pasting half my days.

lol, that's funny!



Interesting perspectives regarding receipts.  I should have started a thread a long time ago.

anyone that has ever worked on a gubmint related project would know just about 50 emails a day go out with the reply all... and it HAS to be that way....

Finally, someone who agrees with me (other than Kev)!

Is it email free Friday yet?


 ;D

Okay, we'll leave it on for you.  Seems like you might be in the minority, but minorities rule, right? :D

I have used it "purposefully", too.  I would say though, most people don't have a use for it, especially home users.

lol.  No!

Purposely v. purposefully. 

I figured someone would go there.  I also figured that someone would be EAGLE. :)

I like mine better.

lol. 

Yeah, I meant purposely, mistyped it, edited it (not paying enough attention to my choice apparently - ugh).  Bunch of mistakes these last few days.  Oh, well.  Both words could be accurate in this case.  Though, I like your choice better, too.

dethaw.

[sm_rolling] :D

*Response time - ok, but thats pretty minimal
*Attachments - a peeve of mine*, but drag and drop can sometimes save time.
*Offline - a pretty limited use case, and one I thought of before responding the first time - fits in my 5% rule.
*Security - do you mean encryption? cus both can do that.  Other than that I disagree - having any local storage is inherently less secure.  I just received my third letter this year from yet another financial institution that had a laptop stolen and customer data compromised.
*Search - I have this too.
*Multiple accounts - ok, I can have multiple, but when responding to email I cannot change how it appears to others (to make it look like it came form the original account).



*Attachments peeve - its always bugged me that people within a company use email as a file sharing application.  Send 10 people 10 copies of a file thats already on the damned shared storage, then email out 5 additional copies to 10 people for every revision...  UGH.  A link to the file is too much to ask??

But hey - storage is cheap right?  Not so fast.  30,000 employees, loads of highly reliable storage (EMC or IBM SAN), then replicate it across two data centers, add in a regulated industry where you must archive ALL emails for 7 years... you got yourself a mess.  I'm not on the email team, but the last evaluation done exposed to us that over 60% of our email storage was being consumed by duplicate files (many of which didn't need to be there to begin with).  Half a million here, half a million there, half a million over yonder - soon enough it adds up to real money.  All because we cannot change the behavior of users that got used to something and won't change.

I couldn't disagree more.  That's why I listed it first.  I can arrow down through 30 emails glancing at the first line in 30 seconds.  No chance in webmail.  Unless of course you have a kick ass webmail I've not seen.


Your rant at the bottom is logical but as you know internet mail is a tinker's nightmare.  It's a hodge-podge of standards some of which, including SMTP and mail-related DNS, couldn't have remotely contemplated what it has become.  I tell you what.  Get my boss to quit sending out attachments and I will too.  For that matter, get the COO or IT Director to do so.  Good luck.


At home or office, yes.  Laptop on the road, no.  On a plane trip I can create a dozen drafts and kick 'em all out the door when I land.  Sames goes for a bus or commuter train.  Not huge for me as I don't travel much but for some it's huge.


Local storage is not inherently less secure.  Physical security is one page one of the security handbook and wraps up the epilogue to boot.  Having my private personal or confidential business email available to anyone who can gain my password is a huge exposure.  I'm not saying people don't leave their laptops in their backseat or expose their home network to anyone.  That's why I included a caveat in my response.  However, I'm very happy that I control where my data is and who has access to it.

I recognize that you're coming from a different perspective than a small company or individual.  Your corporate webmail may be housed at NSA but most of the world uses a service.  If that service's security is breached, or if a credentialed employee at that service decides he wants to read everything I've ever sent, I'm toast.


I submit not as fast, customizable or eloquent as mine but that's probably open to debate. 


I mean multiple accounts in one place.  I can't merge my Google mail with my Yahoo mail with my AOL mail.  On my desktop I have all my accounts in one place.  I can filter and drop according to my wishes.  One login gets me everything.




Oh, one more thing, forged kicks ass.

LMAO!  Karma.  I was gonna throw that in earlier, but was never in the debate, and figured I hadn't earned it.

 ;)

Local storage - we are going to disagree.  If it was not an issue I would not have received three letters this year from breaches resulting from poor, or non-existent, local storage policies.  If it was not the case we would not have gone to such levels as to prevent local storage on our PCs and laptops, or to rollout disk encryption as we are about to.  We don't spend the money unless its justified trust me.  If its a one pager in your handbook, I respectfully suggest that you need a new book.

As for response time... I read my emails, so I am unfamiliar with your behavior  :D.  I can however select a view that will show me the first few lines of my emails on one page - but realistically not 30 at a time.

Offline stuff - I still think its a 5% rule.  Having spent several years traveling every other week I am very familiar with this.  Out of every 100 travelers, 25 will *say* they use it - and 5 will actually use it.  I saw many people try it once and never use it again.

Search - yeah, ok - prolly not as extensive.  But I've never needed more.



Forged does kick ass.

Physical security is on the first page and also the last.  i.e. It's from start to finish.  It's important.  That's my point.

You need a new bank.  ;)

The typo threw me off.


Was an insurance company, an investment firm I no longer have an account with, and........ hmmmm, can't recall - but it wasn't my bank (that I used to work at).

BTW - invited another co-worker into the EPL league.  He overheard Dave and I needling each other and wanted to get in (on the needling I believe)  ;)

well, looks like this afternoon we'll be playing with a new front end box that will become a mail server.  should get postfix/courier/squirrelmail. 

yay

I hated squirrel mail. I opted for the Exchange Server account instead. From what I hear our company is getting rid of it all together.

Late to the party, but I was really bummed because She was driving my Pathfinder when it rolled 88888 last week.  :sad3:

Serving no further purpose. Shutting up and going away.

no you guys collect RADAR currency too ?

Actually meant 111111.  Shoulda used a comma.   ;)

Last week, my car was at 77775 when I looked at the odometer. I looked again later, and it was 77782. I thought to myself, "Oops. I guess I'll look again in 11106 miles."

When this baby hits 11111, you're gonna see some serious *feces*.

(http://www.moovienet.de/main/filmdat/313.jpg)