GolfHos

We seem to have lots of strong grammar opinions around here.

What's your take on serial commas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_comma)?

I guess I'm for it.  That's the way I was taught.

Yeah, I was taught that way, too.  I had a disagreement with someone who used to write for various (U.S.) newspapers about it, though.  I also noticed in the "In Honor of Jules" thread, that neither the panda nor the wombat had serial commas.

I was taught 'without.'

Also, period goes within quotes.

Good call. I always forget that.  [sm_anon]

Well I think that's some serious, stupid *fudge*ed bull*feces* and dumb assed *feces*.

LMAO   [sm_rolling]

Against it.  Without wanting anyone (Jules) to take it the wrong way, I was taught that the better one wrote, the less aid the reader required to navigate the text.  Most of the arguments in favor (in that Wiki entry) can be easily and more effectively avoided by better crafting of the sentence.

I.e., don't hate the comma, hate the game.

I was taught 'against.'

And now that's how I roll.

I always use a comma before the conjunction in a list but never use one before a terminating "too".

I voted against, but I'll use it either way, depending on my mood. ;)
Almost committed the ultimate gaff, by saying, 'but I'll go either way, depending on my mood'.

I was taught to use it in Elementary school but I always thought it was stupid.  Then when I found out in college it wasn't cool anymore, I dropped it like a bad habit. 

I voted "for it" because that's how I write.  I suppose being taught to use it has something to do with that.

Just wondering if you folks had opinions of your own or just meekly follow what you were taught?
 [sm_devil]

It is revolting to have no better reason for a rule of law than that so it was laid down in the time of Henry IV.
--Oliver Wendell Holmes

When someone writes well, the lack of commas is indeed fine.  The problem arises when you are left to decipher what someone has written because they do not write well. 

I guess you could say that's another reason I'm "for it" (I know enough people who don't write well).  I care, but I don't.  In a way, that sounds odd, but it's true.  Still, I voted "for it".

I thought the Pyrenees separated Spain and Portugal from France.   ???

Far be it for me to disagree with Clive, as he is both more educated, and likely more intelligent than I, but I am in favor of the serial/Oxford/Harvard/Libtard comma. It is my personal opinion that the additional comma prior to "and" indicates that what is mentioned is a separate, and to be considered separate, item in a list.

To readdress the examples in the wiki article: "I would like to dedicate this to Jim, Steve, Ed, my brother and my mentor" vs "I would like to dedicate this to Jim, Steve, Ed, my brother, and my mentor." The former leaves open the ambiguous possibility for my brother to also be my mentor, the latter, on the other hand, makes clear that my brother and my mentor are to be considered separate entities.

On the other hand, I agree that the hazard can be avoided by a better crafted sentence. I consider that, still, neither here nor there.

We live in a world that has poorly constructed sentences, and deep down in places I don't talk about at parties, I want that comma in that sentence. I need that comma in that sentence. We use commas to separate words like honor, code, loyalty. We use these commas as the backbone of separating items in a list. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain my grammar to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the clarity of the sentences I write, and then questions the manner in which I write them. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a copy of Strunk and White, and write a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to.

Wow!!!  ::)

Spacey undresses in front of God and everyone.   ;)

I submit that, in that sentence, the "ambiguity" exists only with those people who expect a serial comma and don't get one.

In real life, you seldom see a mixed group like those of the strained Wiki examples.  It's far, far more common to see like items in a list (e.g. silver, copper, zinc and titanium).  For that reason, I will grudgingly and very sparingly use a serial comma if I think the typical reader would otherwise be confused by the lack of one (which includes sentence structure, list composition and intended audience).

I was taught not to marry my cousin.  I wasn't aware I could act on my opinion.

I have always used the comma.

However down here in Texas any punctuation is optional. Spelling and grammar too.

I was also taught not to end a sentence, paragraph or a post with a preposition.  But to each his own I guess so. 

Where'd you learn that from?

"This is the sort of English up with which I will not put."

(http://tmq2.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/churchill.jpg)

[Busy looking at avatar] Huh, what, you say something? [/Still busy looking at avatar]

I'm a period outside the quotes guy...

I still put two spaces after a period. :-[

And sometimes I'll bust out a four-dot ellipsis if I'm feeling saucy.
(in homage to the Star Wars opening crawl)

That's how it should be! ;)

That's how I was taught.  And FTR.........My cousin is hot!

That's nice.  Does he/she put out??

I try to put a good amount of space between myself and my wife's periods.

Eventually, that, too, will end.

Minnesota: Home of the Hanging Preposition.

Those dear Sisters of the Immaculate Heart of Mary order in Scranton were for it, and although I tested their patience on numerous occasions, they could not be dissuaded in their conviction regarding the serial comma.  I could find no other chinks in their grammatical armor, so I gave up the fight regarding this subjective nuance, and could not be happier as a serial commatist myself. 

Those old gals were pretty smart, and they broke me of the use of prepositions at the end of sentences in a way that remains with me to this day.  I'd say, "Where is she at?", and Sister Kieren would say, "Between the 'a' and the 't'."  I sometimes say it to this day when I can no longer stand the butchering, but most of the twentysomethings have no idea what I'm talking about.

Put a red hat on this! 

(http://www.unclemelon.com/beacuke.jpg)

I would rather it was spelt armour

It was when England ran the world.  Pax Britannica wot.

As would I, 2iron, but the spell checker kept flagging it, which made me second guess my original spelling.

And I'll not ask if you're afflicted with celiac.

Would you mind repeating the question, I was in the loo.... ;)