Uisce Beatha
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: In the Jar
Karma: 116 Posts: 7357
OfflineGet me the tank!
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #15 on: February 15, 2007, 11:09:48 AM » |
|
Having just seen Clive's photo I reckon there's zero problem on the adjustibility front.
|
|
|
Logged
|
"If you're darker than a caramel, Reverend Al speaks for you." - Aasif Mandvi "Well, you can tell by the way I use my walk, I'm a woman's man: no time to talk." - stroh
|
|
|
Clive
Full Metal Jacket
Karma: 77 Posts: 4358
Offline
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #16 on: February 15, 2007, 11:17:13 AM » |
|
The pic is clearer is you shake your head while viewing it.
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
spacey
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: Group W Bench
Karma: 98 Posts: 7733
Offline
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2007, 12:29:29 PM » |
|
Returning to the original point: It seems to me that determining what actually constitutes "normal course of play" is pretty central to the question at hand. If the weight comes out while riding on the cart, is that different than if the weight comes out if the putter is slammed into the bag? I don't know if there is a definition of terms available or if this is just one of those vagaries of the USGA rules.
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
stroh
Sleeveless Hoodie From: Impact Crater Springs, CA
Karma: 155 Posts: 16135
OfflineWe're doomed!
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #18 on: February 15, 2007, 12:29:56 PM » |
|
The pic is clearer is you shake your head while viewing it. Not unlike your posts.
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Uisce Beatha
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: In the Jar
Karma: 116 Posts: 7357
OfflineGet me the tank!
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #19 on: February 15, 2007, 01:05:45 PM » |
|
Returning to the original point: It seems to me that determining what actually constitutes "normal course of play" is pretty central to the question at hand. If the weight comes out while riding on the cart, is that different than if the weight comes out if the putter is slammed into the bag? I don't know if there is a definition of terms available or if this is just one of those vagaries of the USGA rules.
4-3/1 Meaning of Damage Sustained in "Normal Course of Play"
Q. In Rule 4-3a, what is meant by the term "normal course of play"?
A. The term "normal course of play" is intended to cover all reasonable acts but specifically excludes cases of abuse.
In addition to making a stroke, practice swing or practice stroke, examples of acts that are in the "normal course of play" include the following:
* removing or replacing a club in the bag; * using a club to search for or retrieve a ball; * leaning on a club while waiting to play, teeing a ball or removing a ball from the hole; or * accidentally dropping a club.
Examples of acts that are not in the "normal course of play" include the following:
* throwing a club in anger or otherwise; * 'slamming' a club into a bag; or * intentionally striking something (e.g., the ground or a tree) with the club other than during a stroke, practice swing or practice stroke. (Revised) Is the club "damaged" when removable-by-design bits of it fall off? Damaged isn't listed in the definitions yet correct interpretation of terms in the Rules of Golf are very important. This is probably relevant: 4-2/0.5 Lead Tape Applied to Clubhead or Shaft During Round
Q. With regard to Decision 4-1/4, may a player remove, add or alter lead tape during a round?
A. No. However, lead tape that becomes detached from the club in the normal course of play may be placed back onto the club in the same location. If the lead tape will not remain on the club in the same location, new tape may be used. Every effort should be made to restore the club, as nearly as possible, to its previous condition. Alternatively, the club may be used in its damaged state (without the lead tape) for the remainder of the round (Rule 4-3a).
If the tape is altered or damaged other than in the normal course of play, the club may not be used for the remainder of the round, under penalty of disqualification (see Rules 4-2a and 4-3). I say Clive's club is damaged during the normal course of play and I say it may be fixed (or not) without penalty.
|
|
|
Logged
|
"If you're darker than a caramel, Reverend Al speaks for you." - Aasif Mandvi "Well, you can tell by the way I use my walk, I'm a woman's man: no time to talk." - stroh
|
|
|
Clive
Full Metal Jacket
Karma: 77 Posts: 4358
Offline
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2007, 01:10:18 PM » |
|
Uisce: say I don't have the proper weights to replace the lost ones, similar to the 4-2/0.5 player unable to replace his missing lead tape. What to do? Everything now turns on whether the loss occurred in the normal course of play.
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Uisce Beatha
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: In the Jar
Karma: 116 Posts: 7357
OfflineGet me the tank!
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2007, 01:14:23 PM » |
|
Uisce: say I don't have the proper weights to replace the lost ones, similar to the 4-2/0.5 player unable to replace his missing lead tape. What to do? Everything now turns on whether the loss occurred in the normal course of play.
So did you do anything during the round, involving your putter, that might be considered not in the normal course of play? If so, grab your 4-iron. You either did or did not damage it in the normal course of play. You know how that goes, it's simply a fact. If you have no way of knowing for sure then better not take your chances with the committee.
|
|
|
Logged
|
"If you're darker than a caramel, Reverend Al speaks for you." - Aasif Mandvi "Well, you can tell by the way I use my walk, I'm a woman's man: no time to talk." - stroh
|
|
|
spacey
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: Group W Bench
Karma: 98 Posts: 7733
Offline
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2007, 01:58:29 PM » |
|
The examples of things that do not meet the "normal course of play" standard all strike me as intentional or deliberate actions that one would probably realize. I have a hard time envisioning an action that would be considered not in the "normal course of play" that one wouldn't realize or remember.
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Uisce Beatha
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: In the Jar
Karma: 116 Posts: 7357
OfflineGet me the tank!
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2007, 02:24:34 PM » |
|
The examples of things that do not meet the "normal course of play" standard all strike me as intentional or deliberate actions that one would probably realize. I have a hard time envisioning an action that would be considered not in the "normal course of play" that one wouldn't realize or remember. True, you're going to recognize/remember the action. Where the problem arises is in a scenario like this: Clive misses a two foot putt for birdie on #5. On the way back to his bag he bangs his putter against the ground in anger. Slams it in his bag and proceeds to the next tee. On the #7 green he notices one of the weights are missing. Did this happen as a result of the "not in the course of play" action back on #5? Did he use it illegally on #6? Was it okay on #6 and just fell out 10 seconds ago? Was it already loose when he started the round and fell out on #1? This all comes into play in trying to figure out if a rule has been broken or even if the club is allowed to be used for the remainder of the round. If it were me, I'd put the club away and not use it the rest of the day. I'd then report the circumstances to the committee. The fact that an action occurred that would be considered "not in the course of play" and subsequently, due to that action or not, it is noticed the club is damaged causes significant problems for a player. [edit: spelling. two foot butt??? good grief.)
|
|
« Last Edit: February 15, 2007, 02:43:37 PM by Uisce Beatha »
|
Logged
|
"If you're darker than a caramel, Reverend Al speaks for you." - Aasif Mandvi "Well, you can tell by the way I use my walk, I'm a woman's man: no time to talk." - stroh
|
|
|
gleek
Flak Jacket
Karma: 107 Posts: 9510
OfflineE chu ta!
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #24 on: February 15, 2007, 06:05:52 PM » |
|
This is a kinder, gentler place and I really am not trying to start something but I've always wondered this about Mentor's putters. I asked Chin about it right after he first started posting on FIGS and he assured me all was in order. He seemed a bit defensive at the time (perhaps a bad inference) and I let it go.
What? Defensive? When am I ever defensive? I don't know what you're talking about.
|
|
|
Logged
|
Woman, open the door, don't let it sting. I wanna breathe that fire again.
|
|
|
Uisce Beatha
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: In the Jar
Karma: 116 Posts: 7357
OfflineGet me the tank!
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #25 on: February 15, 2007, 06:32:31 PM » |
|
This is a kinder, gentler place and I really am not trying to start something but I've always wondered this about Mentor's putters. I asked Chin about it right after he first started posting on FIGS and he assured me all was in order. He seemed a bit defensive at the time (perhaps a bad inference) and I let it go.
What? Defensive? When am I ever defensive? I don't know what you're talking about. Whew. Thanks for being a good sport cbae. I really hoped to have the discussion without rubbing you the wrong way, errrrmmm, pissing you off.
|
|
|
Logged
|
"If you're darker than a caramel, Reverend Al speaks for you." - Aasif Mandvi "Well, you can tell by the way I use my walk, I'm a woman's man: no time to talk." - stroh
|
|
|
gleek
Flak Jacket
Karma: 107 Posts: 9510
OfflineE chu ta!
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #26 on: February 15, 2007, 06:36:40 PM » |
|
This is a kinder, gentler place and I really am not trying to start something but I've always wondered this about Mentor's putters. I asked Chin about it right after he first started posting on FIGS and he assured me all was in order. He seemed a bit defensive at the time (perhaps a bad inference) and I let it go.
What? Defensive? When am I ever defensive? I don't know what you're talking about. Whew. Thanks for being a good sport cbae. I really hoped to have the discussion without rubbing you the wrong way, errrrmmm, pissing you off. Good sport? I don't know what you're talking about.
|
|
|
Logged
|
Woman, open the door, don't let it sting. I wanna breathe that fire again.
|
|
|
spacey
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: Group W Bench
Karma: 98 Posts: 7733
Offline
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #27 on: February 15, 2007, 06:39:49 PM » |
|
This is a kinder, gentler place and I really am not trying to start something but I've always wondered this about Mentor's putters. I asked Chin about it right after he first started posting on FIGS and he assured me all was in order. He seemed a bit defensive at the time (perhaps a bad inference) and I let it go.
What? Defensive? When am I ever defensive? I don't know what you're talking about. Whew. Thanks for being a good sport cbae. I really hoped to have the discussion without rubbing you the wrong way, errrrmmm, pissing you off. Shill.
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
stroh
Sleeveless Hoodie From: Impact Crater Springs, CA
Karma: 155 Posts: 16135
OfflineWe're doomed!
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #28 on: February 15, 2007, 07:28:21 PM » |
|
Shill.
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Uisce Beatha
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: In the Jar
Karma: 116 Posts: 7357
OfflineGet me the tank!
|
|
Re: Weights in Sweet Mentorsports Putter
« Reply #29 on: February 15, 2007, 07:53:27 PM » |
|
Shill. I just can't read that word without thinking about Spuzz *goshdarn* with Adam Barr. Brings a smile to my face. Like memories of childhood.
|
|
|
Logged
|
"If you're darker than a caramel, Reverend Al speaks for you." - Aasif Mandvi "Well, you can tell by the way I use my walk, I'm a woman's man: no time to talk." - stroh
|
|
|