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[RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?

 
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Fuzzy
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[RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« on: October 02, 2008, 07:43:10 PM »

From tonights debate:

Quote
Number two, with regard to bankruptcy now, Gwen, what we should be doing now -- and Barack Obama and I support it -- we should be allowing bankruptcy courts to be able to re-adjust not just the interest rate you're paying on your mortgage to be able to stay in your home, but be able to adjust the principal that you owe, the principal that you owe.

What? Seriously. What The *fudge*?

Hypothetical: My neighbor and I buy houses across the street from each other. I put 30% down and get a nice fixed mortgage and happily pay every month. He puts nothing down and gets a bull*feces* ARM, blah, blah and three years later is upside down *fudge*ed.

Now he gets to adjust his principal? Really? And *fudge* over everyone in the neighborhood who played by the rules.

No....no. I don't care if you work it out to pay $10 or $10,000 per month but pay the principal you signed up for boys. All of a sudden you are able to make a (hypothetical numbers) $500,000 loan a $300,000 loan?

Bull*feces*. Bull*feces*. Bull*feces*. Do I get to adjust my principal for actually knowing what I was doing and living within my means?

And I'm sure X years down the road when he sells his house they'll make them share the capital gains on the reset principle.  Roll Eyes

I really hope I'm missing something with Biden's comment. Off to the Google.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2008, 09:40:24 PM by Fuzzy » Logged Return to Top

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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2008, 07:45:22 PM »

From tonights debate:

Quote
Number two, with regard to bankruptcy now, Gwen, what we should be doing now -- and Barack Obama and I support it -- we should be allowing bankruptcy courts to be able to re-adjust not just the interest rate you're paying on your mortgage to be able to stay in your home, but be able to adjust the principal that you owe, the principal that you owe.

What? Seriously. What The *fudge*?

Hypothetical: My neighbor and I buy houses across the street from each other. I put 30% down and get a nice fixed mortgage and happily pay every month. He puts nothing down and gets a bull*feces* ARM, blah, blah and three years later is upside down *fudge*ed.

Now he gets to adjust his principal? Really? And *fudge* over everyone in the neighborhood who played by the rules.

No....no. I don't care if you work it out to pay $10 or $10,000 per month but pay the principal you signed up for boys. If all of a sudden you are able to make a (hypothetical numbers) $500,000 loan a $300,000 loan?

Bull*feces*. Bull*feces*. Bull*feces*. Do I get to adjust my principal for actually knowing what I was doing and living within my means?

And I'm sure X years down the road when he sells his house they'll make them share the capital gains on the reset principal.  Roll Eyes


I would assume that they would still be considered in default of their original loan and have a ding against their credit. This is far better than allowing them to walk away owing nothing.
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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2008, 07:51:00 PM »

From tonights debate:

Quote
Number two, with regard to bankruptcy now, Gwen, what we should be doing now -- and Barack Obama and I support it -- we should be allowing bankruptcy courts to be able to re-adjust not just the interest rate you're paying on your mortgage to be able to stay in your home, but be able to adjust the principal that you owe, the principal that you owe.

What? Seriously. What The *fudge*?

Hypothetical: My neighbor and I buy houses across the street from each other. I put 30% down and get a nice fixed mortgage and happily pay every month. He puts nothing down and gets a bull*feces* ARM, blah, blah and three years later is upside down *fudge*ed.

Now he gets to adjust his principal? Really? And *fudge* over everyone in the neighborhood who played by the rules.

No....no. I don't care if you work it out to pay $10 or $10,000 per month but pay the principal you signed up for boys. If all of a sudden you are able to make a (hypothetical numbers) $500,000 loan a $300,000 loan?

Bull*feces*. Bull*feces*. Bull*feces*. Do I get to adjust my principal for actually knowing what I was doing and living within my means?

And I'm sure X years down the road when he sells his house they'll make them share the capital gains on the reset principal.  Roll Eyes


I would assume that they would still be considered in default of their original loan and have a ding against their credit. This is far better than allowing them to walk away owing nothing.

Put it this way:

I'll have to do the math but quick thinking in my head it seems I'd be better off 15 years down the road if I "can't" make my payments today and reset my principal. The ROI on the future sale might be worth the ding.

Sorry. This is complete bull*feces* from where I sit. I have no problem working out something that helps homeowners. But don't *goshdarn* reward them and screw people like me who did everything right.

This is the one issue that pisses me off. Banks make bad loans to people who can't understand why they shouldn't own homes 3x what they can afford.
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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2008, 08:15:05 PM »

*comments in the last 60 minutes fueled by Finnegan's Amber. But I believe I will still think this stinks in the morning...................
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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2008, 09:06:08 PM »

Bear in mind that this great little scheme to wipe off some of the mortgage principal is being extended to people in bankruptcy court.  Saying it's a big win for them is like saying Stroh is a big fan of Carrie Nation, Aske has warm feelings for GW Bush, or Hobbit is straight.
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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2008, 09:17:15 PM »

At the end of the day what's the difference? If I leave the principle alone and slash the interest, or leave the interest alone and slash the principle, or a combination of the two, there's not much difference except you're writing off the interest payments and not the principle payments on your taxes. Either way we're adjusting the amount people have to pay in order to make the unaffordable, affordable. If you take someone who was paying $2000 a month for 360 months and you instead have them paying $1600 a month for 360 a month, does it really matter how much is principle or interest? I think it only matters if they borrower has the option to reduce the principle and then refinance in the future with a different lender. Otherwise I'm not sure it matters.

One more thing at the end of the day, no matter what you're probably better off if you neighbor is not in foreclosure. It kills your property value.
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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2008, 09:39:49 PM »

in order to make the unaffordable, affordable.

That is probably the root of my problem. I really don't want to bail out anybody - banks/credit industry/people.......The homes were UNAFFORDABLE to begin with and and the blame game can be played in multiple directions. I know we have to stabilize the credit market and a "bailout" will almost certainly have to occur but that doesn't mean I have to like it.

And I get the impact of mass foreclosures. It just pisses me off to no end that I have to end up paying for them.

But tomorrow I'm still going to do the math on whether or not it would be better to adjust the principal or the interest rate from the individual homeowners point of view. Devil


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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #7 on: October 02, 2008, 10:03:37 PM »


One more thing at the end of the day, no matter what you're probably better off if you neighbor is not in foreclosure. It kills your property value.

It does kill the property value;  I understand that argument.  But for those who have made fiscally responsible decisions, making sure to never buy more than they can afford, I also understand how they might be pissed if they are paying $500 to $1000 more per month than their neighbor for the same value home.  *fudge* it, I ain't saying anymore.  I just read Fuzzy's response.

What Fuzzy said.
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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #8 on: October 03, 2008, 12:39:08 AM »

My comments would be fueled by Boulevard Unfiltered Wheat - so I'll just return to my political, and somewhat complete, hiatus on this site.

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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #9 on: October 03, 2008, 05:24:56 AM »

As JD points out, bailing out your neighbor bails you out

Perhaps you got up to take a leak when that was covered in "It's a Wonderful Life"



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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #10 on: October 03, 2008, 05:26:57 AM »

LOL


Clarence.
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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #11 on: October 03, 2008, 06:11:02 AM »


One more thing at the end of the day, no matter what you're probably better off if you neighbor is not in foreclosure. It kills your property value.

It does kill the property value;  I understand that argument.  But for those who have made fiscally responsible decisions, making sure to never buy more than they can afford, I also understand how they might be pissed if they are paying $500 to $1000 more per month than their neighbor for the same value home.  *fudge* it, I ain't saying anymore.  I just read Fuzzy's response.

What Fuzzy said.
I get it, and what fuzzy said. I just don't feel like watching the ship sink in the name of fairness.

If my neighbor gets bailed out it might not hit me that hard at the end of the day. It's possible that this $750b nut won't wind up being anywhere close to that number when the market finally gets liquid again. But if we don't bail out my neighbor he's *fudge*ed and so am I.

Like it or not we're all in this one together, and this *feces* is dire.
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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #12 on: October 03, 2008, 06:19:07 AM »



But tomorrow I'm still going to do the math on whether or not it would be better to adjust the principal or the interest rate from the individual homeowners point of view. Devil



It depends on the terms. Unless the terms are extremely restrictive then it would be better (for the borrower) to adjust the principle. But I have no idea if the bailout will restrict one's ability to write off interest or not. The big upside to a principle adjustment is, of course, the ability to eventually sell and pocket free money; but again, that may be restricted or accounted for in the language of the law as well.

My only point was that X amount per month is X amount per month, regardless of how much is P or I.
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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #13 on: October 03, 2008, 06:39:47 AM »


One more thing at the end of the day, no matter what you're probably better off if you neighbor is not in foreclosure. It kills your property value.

It does kill the property value;  I understand that argument.  But for those who have made fiscally responsible decisions, making sure to never buy more than they can afford, I also understand how they might be pissed if they are paying $500 to $1000 more per month than their neighbor for the same value home.  *fudge* it, I ain't saying anymore.  I just read Fuzzy's response.

What Fuzzy said.
...............Like it or not we're all in this one together, and this *feces* is dire.

 Coffee

I think we are all in agreement. I stand by my dislike of rewarding bad behavior. Mainly because I don't believe a lot of those who get bailed out will learn their lesson down the road.

And I've decided not to work out the math. Next time I have a few beers maybe.  Wink  My main point was that they better not profit on a reduced principal come selling time to which you alluded.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2008, 06:47:05 AM by Fuzzy » Logged Return to Top

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Re: [RANT] [Politics/Religion] Serious Joe Biden WTF?
« Reply #14 on: October 03, 2008, 06:55:32 AM »

This just isn't a good time to do rendition and torture on our neighbors...that would be more reckless than what they've done.

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