birdymaker
Straitjacket From: a third world country in the making
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if you want to buy an iphone......
« on: October 29, 2007, 06:36:11 AM » |
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women are like tornados. In the beginning there's a lot of sucking and blowing. In the end, the car's gone, the house is gone..
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stroh
Sleeveless Hoodie From: Impact Crater Springs, CA
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2007, 06:45:59 AM » |
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« Last Edit: October 29, 2007, 06:50:16 AM by stroh »
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Uisce Beatha
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: In the Jar
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2007, 07:40:20 AM » |
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Extreme measures to say the least. Re: the iPhone hacking debate though, if I buy hardware of any of the following types should I expect, nay demand, it to work with other providers?
* Satellite dish/receivers and cable boxes. Granted, the latter are usually a lease.
* In-vehicle safety and security systems (OnStar).
* Digital video recorders (TiVo).
That's three off the top of my head. I'm sure there are more. My point is that due to the strange dynamics of Apple's relationship with the world (love 'em, hate 'em or live without opinion in the jungles of Borneo - there don't seem to be other possibilities) it seems that it's alright to expect them to act differently than other proprietary vendors. It's very strange.
Apple has delivered nothing but proprietary products for close to 30 years. Everyone knows this. Everyone. If you buy a Mac you can't install Windows or any other OS other than in emulation. If you buy an iPod you have to send it to Apple for battery replacement. If you buy an iPhone you have to use AT&T in the U.S. If you decide to engineer a solution you're likely going to void your warranty. It's all laid out in black-and-white.
Why people don't/can't get this is beyond me. Well, not really. I think there are at least these two components. (1) Apple makes good stuff. People want to own it but they want to own it on their terms for some reason. (2) Class-action lawsuits are good money - for the lawyers if not the plaintiffs.
For me though, if you don't want Apple products on Apple's terms, you should simply buy something else. Market forces will determine if their strategy is viable.
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"If you're darker than a caramel, Reverend Al speaks for you." - Aasif Mandvi
"Well, you can tell by the way I use my walk, I'm a woman's man: no time to talk." - stroh
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hobbit
Tartan Jacket From: The Shire
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2007, 07:50:09 AM » |
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Here's an idea for Apple - make enough so that anyone that wants to buy them can get one, or two, or ten. They already control the cost, so margin loss isn't a concern. Seems simple enough to me. But I guess the media frenzy that is created by always selling out of your units in hours is attractive, even if its not maximizing profits.
And Uisce is right - the lawsuits have little merit. Frustration aside, its just the nature of the business - these people bitching about it need to get over it.
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stroh
Sleeveless Hoodie From: Impact Crater Springs, CA
Karma: 155 Posts: 16135
OfflineWe're doomed!
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2007, 07:51:55 AM » |
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Very well written. Excellent take. Agree 100 percent.
Isn't refusal to take cash a discriminatory practice, and one that has been tagged as oppressive to the poor by forcing them into credit obligations they are unable to afford?
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« Last Edit: October 29, 2007, 07:53:32 AM by stroh »
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Uisce Beatha
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: In the Jar
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2007, 09:44:39 AM » |
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Here's an idea for Apple - make enough so that anyone that wants to buy them can get one, or two, or ten. They already control the cost, so margin loss isn't a concern. Seems simple enough to me. But I guess the media frenzy that is created by always selling out of your units in hours is attractive, even if its not maximizing profits.
This less about production capacities than it is: 1) Placating AT&T. Apple needs AT&T right now. If they don't do what they can to keep AT&T in the loop I suspect there's a case to be made they're violating their end of the deal. 2) Controlling the product. The iPhone hacks don't do anything for Apple at all. Having people break their phones, ask for support and then bitch about the fact it's not forthcoming is a bad thing. Apple has always tightly controlled its products which goes a long way toward why their designs work and win awards. |
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"If you're darker than a caramel, Reverend Al speaks for you." - Aasif Mandvi
"Well, you can tell by the way I use my walk, I'm a woman's man: no time to talk." - stroh
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birdymaker
Straitjacket From: a third world country in the making
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2007, 11:20:54 AM » |
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apple doesn't need att. they chose to climb in bed with att. nobody forced them to. i agree apple is welcome to sell their products to anybody they choose, with the exception of refusing to accept american cash. if thats the choice that they wish to make then there should be major penalties to pay. usice, why do you hate amerika?  |
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women are like tornados. In the beginning there's a lot of sucking and blowing. In the end, the car's gone, the house is gone..
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Uisce Beatha
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: In the Jar
Karma: 116 Posts: 7357
OfflineGet me the tank!
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2007, 11:28:45 AM » |
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apple doesn't need att. they chose to climb in bed with att. nobody forced them to. i agree apple is welcome to sell their products to anybody they choose, with the exception of refusing to accept american cash. if thats the choice that they wish to make then there should be major penalties to pay. usice, why do you hate amerika? Apple's an American company. Don't tell me you carry a Nokia!!!  Calling UAW now...  |
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"If you're darker than a caramel, Reverend Al speaks for you." - Aasif Mandvi
"Well, you can tell by the way I use my walk, I'm a woman's man: no time to talk." - stroh
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stroh
Sleeveless Hoodie From: Impact Crater Springs, CA
Karma: 155 Posts: 16135
OfflineWe're doomed!
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2007, 11:54:08 AM » |
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With all due respect to corporate market strategy, brand allegiance, and consumer satisfaction, why is everyone ignoring my question?  |
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Aske
Lederhosen
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2007, 11:56:47 AM » |
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With all due respect to corporate market strategy, brand allegiance, and consumer satisfaction, why is everyone ignoring my question? at least for me, because i don't know much 'bout the law |
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Russia has invaded a sovereign neighboring state and threatens a democratic government elected by its people. Such an action is unacceptable in the 21st century. -- Chimpy McFlightsuit, CEO of Bu$hco Industries of 'Merka |
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hobbit
Tartan Jacket From: The Shire
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2007, 11:56:53 AM » |
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With all due respect to corporate market strategy, brand allegiance, and consumer satisfaction, why is everyone ignoring my question? Cus we don't know that answer. Buck up little camper. |
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I've gone to find myself. If I get back before I return, keep me here.
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hobbit
Tartan Jacket From: The Shire
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2007, 12:16:39 PM » |
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1) Placating AT&T.
Without a doubt - but I still think its a flawed assessment - perhaps by at&t, perhaps by Apple, perhaps by both. You cannot stop haxors by limiting supply - if people really want to hack an iPhone, the 2-per-person rule won't stop them. And Apple doesn't really need at&t much - the only feature Apple wanted, and had to make an exclusive deal to get, is visual voicemail. As soon as Verizen/Sprint/etc. decide to do it, at&t is just one of the many and Apple is off to world domination - much to at&t's chagrin. Here's the problem for Apple though - the at&t deal lasts for 5 years.... 5 friggin years! Thats an eternity in technology. I don't care how sweet the deal was (revenue sharing), by limiting themselves to one carrier for 5 years, it gives everyone else more than enough time to release an iPhone-killer and make Apple a cell phone footnote. As cool as an iPhone is, the market outside of at&t will absolutely dwarf it. Someone took short term gains at the expense of the long term - thats just stupid to begin with. Then control an already limited market further??? Just nuts. If I ran Apple I'd have an platoon of lawyers trying to find a way out of the at&t deal after 2 years - which is the length of term they should have had to begin with. |
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birdymaker
Straitjacket From: a third world country in the making
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2007, 12:59:08 PM » |
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1) Placating AT&T.
Without a doubt - but I still think its a flawed assessment - perhaps by at&t, perhaps by Apple, perhaps by both. You cannot stop haxors by limiting supply - if people really want to hack an iPhone, the 2-per-person rule won't stop them. And Apple doesn't really need at&t much - the only feature Apple wanted, and had to make an exclusive deal to get, is visual voicemail. As soon as Verizen/Sprint/etc. decide to do it, at&t is just one of the many and Apple is off to world domination - much to at&t's chagrin. Here's the problem for Apple though - the at&t deal lasts for 5 years.... 5 friggin years! Thats an eternity in technology. I don't care how sweet the deal was (revenue sharing), by limiting themselves to one carrier for 5 years, it gives everyone else more than enough time to release an iPhone-killer and make Apple a cell phone footnote. As cool as an iPhone is, the market outside of at&t will absolutely dwarf it. Someone took short term gains at the expense of the long term - thats just stupid to begin with. Then control an already limited market further??? Just nuts. If I ran Apple I'd have an platoon of lawyers trying to find a way out of the at&t deal after 2 years - which is the length of term they should have had to begin with. my thoughts exactly, why limit your market? |
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women are like tornados. In the beginning there's a lot of sucking and blowing. In the end, the car's gone, the house is gone..
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Uisce Beatha
Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat From: In the Jar
Karma: 116 Posts: 7357
OfflineGet me the tank!
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2007, 01:20:21 PM » |
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my thoughts exactly, why limit your market?
Apple doesn't see it as limiting. They see it as controlling their product (see #2 above). The AT&T deal was offered to Verizon first and Verizon wouldn't accept. AT&T did Among other things, Apple wanted a percentage of the monthly cellphone fees, say over how and where iPhones could be sold and control of the relationship with iPhone customers, said Jim Gerace, a Verizon Wireless vice president. "We said no. We have nothing bad to say about the Apple iPhone. We just couldn't reach a deal that was mutually beneficial." Apple wants a controlled user experience. They can't get this by having a relationship with multiple carriers. AT&T was willing to give it to them. Apple wasn't enamored with AT&T. They just needed someone who would comply with their needs. Now that they're in bed on this obviously it's to their mutual benefit to keep each other happy. The iPhone is a cash cow for both companies. [threadjack] Hicks, do you think cellular carriers will look even remotely the same in five years? I wonder if the whole thing doesn't turn into a huge P2P-style network and it really won't matter who you're "with". Am I reading too much sci-fi? [/threadjack] |
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"If you're darker than a caramel, Reverend Al speaks for you." - Aasif Mandvi
"Well, you can tell by the way I use my walk, I'm a woman's man: no time to talk." - stroh
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stroh
Sleeveless Hoodie From: Impact Crater Springs, CA
Karma: 155 Posts: 16135
OfflineWe're doomed!
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Re: if you want to buy an iphone......
« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2007, 01:23:54 PM » |
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Nope.  |
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